Collection of Thoughts Forum: Reluctant Messenger

Collection of Thoughts Forum: Reluctant Messenger http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Collection of Thoughts Forum: Reluctant Messenger en Tue, 06 Jan 2009 08:21:02 +0000 Rediviva on "Unknown ancient(sacred)geometry" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/308#post-21410 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:15:32 +0000 Rediviva 21410@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ I too believe in getting energy boost from the earth. And I've heard that it's a complete (occult) science, positioning houses to aling with energy lines and so forth. Me myself I ain't that systematic, but I like what Castaneda said about getting power from the earth; from there you receive "imperceptible jolts of invigourating energy". I like... starion on "Unknown ancient(sacred)geometry" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/308#post-21409 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:42:07 +0000 starion 21409@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ A possible explanation... geometry is interesting, but I feel something else. The Creator must sustain creation with energy that refreshes, renews, and invigorates and this interesting design appears to be interlinking energy lines... read somewhere that there are lines and intersections where the energy is higher and people living in these intersections have more energy and accomplish more...because of the stronger pulses. Or otherwise said "Where creation flowers.....". Rediviva on "Unknown ancient(sacred)geometry" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/308#post-21402 Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:08:20 +0000 Rediviva 21402@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Nice symbol, but for what? Can't say - but the power of symbols is that they penetrate to your subconscious, while your everyday consciousness contemplates what's to have for dinner, whats on the telly, when will I be famous... Blossoming flower of life - rotating wheels within wheels - poetry in motion... selfseeker on "Regret: Ministry of Public Security (China) does not process" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/356#post-7568 Fri, 15 Jun 2007 14:57:00 +0000 selfseeker 7568@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ My dear xia123, Yours is a really sad story. It has forced me to break my silence. ....Be sure, the guilty will be punished .... that is the laws of Karma. We can hoodwink the justice system here once but the story doesn't end "here". I wish you could get the justice here & now but I can only wish .... but why should you be so much disturbed to spoil your life & also your child's ? Is it going to help ? Why not go in a logical manner with a cool head ? I am unaware of the laws in your country, but there must be some higher court / appelate authority ? Why don't you try there ? I don't know how another country / countrymen help on this issue ... China being a sovereign country ? Unless China agrees no country or organisation may be able to help you, as I feel. However, I am also sure, you can get justice in your country .... just seek the help of a right legal counsel. This is a spiritual forum & therefore, we tend to think in a manner which may not appear worldly-wise. But believe me, that is the correct path which will not only calm you but give you the right direction. If you are ready to listen ..... I see that there has not been any effect on you of what Anam suggested to you. But he gave you the right advice. I don't say that you should not fight the case or accept defeat .... but the way you look desperate & impatient is not a healthy picture. You should fight because this is a case of unjustice ..... but even if you don't get justice ( the way you want), you should accept the outcome with equanimity. You are not running this world. You didn't create your sister. It is your egoist view that She was "your" sister .... she was more to Him who created her. He must be more worried than you are if injustice has been done ..... and He is powerful enough to ensure that justice is done. If you are impatient, that is purely your own problem. The man who killed your sister & those who are guilty of denying justice will be punished for sure ..... but, What about the injustice you are doing to your life & your son ? Who will answer for that ? Who gave you authority to spoil your child's life because your sister died due to negligence of a drunken man ? The people who are still alive are more important than those who are dead. Keep the fight on but don't be blind enough to commmit suicide & kill other innocent souls who are dependent upon you. Be calm .... perfectly cool ... a hot-headed, desperate & impatient man doesn't need any enemy .... he is enough to kill himself ! My best wishes are with you .... selfseeker xia123 on "Regret: Ministry of Public Security (China) does not process" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/356#post-7521 Thu, 14 Jun 2007 01:10:19 +0000 xia123 7521@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Now the world really does not have the axiom? Ministry of Public Securityï¼Œâ€¦â€¦This case hung in the balance for a long time, they insist on the unfair Road Traffic Accident Responsibility Confirming Letter and refuse to cancel or change it according to the People's Police Law of the People's Republic of China. They refuse to execute the law fairlyâ€¦â€¦ What else can I expect? Ministry of Public Securityï¼Œâ€¦â€¦Although I do not deny that the peacebreaker should take on total responsibility of this accident, the written reply of Road Traffic Accident Reliability Reconfirming Letter of making the peacebreaker take on total responsibility is still not worked out. It causes that the artificial irregular grievance has not had a just parlance, so that the body of the inculpable victim is still kept in the funeral home, and can not get cremation. Meanwhile, I appeal to the international just people who maintain peopleâ€™s rights and can help me to get justice. Letâ€™s build a harmonious society! Liaoyuan City, Jilin Province Brother of Victim: Xia Yuanfeng Anam on "Regret: Ministry of Public Security (China) does not process" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/356#post-7371 Mon, 11 Jun 2007 02:35:25 +0000 Anam 7371@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Xia, This is very sad reading, my heart goes out to you, I can not imagine how you feel. One of the main reasons I visit this site is that I am working on forgiveness. I have had many bad things happen to me, I have enemies even now who would like to harm me and my family. The attention that is needed to overcome them is some times so distracting that I feel my life stops and I become the thing I hate most. This state of mind is natural for me, how ever it prohibits my spirit from being truly free. Hatred leads to suffering, you are suffering because of how much hatred you have in youâ€¦ I know what that feels like. It is a heavy burden and one which you can free your self from with sacrifice. The sacrifice you must make is very hard to swallow. You must let go of blame and resentment, you must let go of the unfulfilled dreams of your sister and dream them for her. You must find a path to forgiveness. You may not have exhausted every legal avenue but you have exhausted your self. This world is not fair , bad things happen to good people you as a good man must rise above this now. There is only so much of you to give my friend or you will be but a shell of what you were to be. If you had the chance to be there at that very moment and stopped the incident because you knew it was going to happenâ€¦believe me some thing else would have taken her. It is my belief that we all have our time here, she had done what she was destined to do and is happy elsewhere, it was her time. Try to imagine what the man who did this has to live with. All humans feel we can not help it, we also pay for our deeds one way or other. Be well my Friend. Anam starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7362 Sun, 10 Jun 2007 02:05:17 +0000 starlight 7362@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ oh i totally agree that you do not have to believe in any religious organization to live happily, honestly, and morally...but those words alone are relative concepts... living happily is different for many... and living honestly? OMG...there is cash register honesty, then there is honesty with others, and there is honesty with self... and morally? every one has an opionion on what is moral...that is why we have so many religions! so, your ideas of any or all...are still beliefs... btw...do you really believe it will rain, or do you think it might? cortex on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7358 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 22:25:24 +0000 cortex 7358@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ star, look at what i told shin regarding a similar idea with a different word. "i believe that it will rain" is alot different from "i believe that i will go to hell if im bad" the difference? one belief is realistic, the other is totally religious. xia123 on "Regret: Ministry of Public Security (China) does not process" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/356#post-7356 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 21:49:09 +0000 xia123 7356@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Regret: Ministry of Public Security (China) does not process My name is XIA Yuanfeng, a Chinese citizen living in Liaoyuan City, Jilin Province. I am writing this letter to accuse the Liaoyuan Judicatory Departments of bending the law and abusing power. In 1998, my sister, XIA Lianqun was hit by a speeding car driven by a drunken man, XU Shaoqi. Instead of getting urgent treatment, my sister was left injured on the road and was only sent to the hospital 40 minutes later (The murderer even took his time to make several phone calls while my sister was bleeding and dying). What was more ironic is that the hospital was only 200 meters away from spot where the accident took place! Having not got treatment in time, my sister passed away eventually. What happened afterward was really beyond my understanding and tolerance. For some reason, the Road and Traffic Administration Department didn¡¯t give XU Shaoqi either criminal or administrative punishment. They released this murderer shortly after the accident and exclaimed that the person had run away, which, of course was a total lie. I was once put into prison because I could not keep my silence and let justice denied. For 8 years, the related authorities haven¡¯t done anything to investigate the case nor tried to settle it. My sister¡¯s body is still detained in the funeral parlor while the murder is at large. In the past years, I have dedicated most of my time to appealing to relevant authorities in hoping that the dignity of law would be defended and the rights of innocent people could be protected. I lost my job and spent my saving for that and I because penniless. Now my son has got the Letter of Acceptance for his college education and I can not even afford it. ========================================================================================= ¢ñ The following is clearly written in No. 2110153 Road Traffic Accident Reliability Confirming Letter made by Liaoyuan Traffic Accident Handling Group of Pointsmen Detachment on November 30th, 1998: Confirming Letter of Reliability of Road Traffic Accident No. 2110153 Time: November 13th, 1998 16:40 Place: Thirty meters before Yindu bathhouse on Kuangdian Street On November 13th, 1998 16:40, Xu Shaoqi (male, 50-year old), an inhabitant of Sunrise 4th Group, Dengta Village, Xi¡¯an District in Liaoyuan City, drove Southern125B mode motorcycle marking Ji D50813 from north to south along Kuangdian Street. When he drove thirty meters south to Yindu Bathhouse, because of drunk driving and speeding, he crashed with Xia Lianqun (female, 41-year old, a worker of Liaoyuan Coal and Machine Factory), who was crossing the road from the east of the road by a bicycle. Xia Lianqun was hurt on the head and died after void salvage of the hospital on the same day. According to the investigation on spot, it is confirmed that party Xia Lianqun did not implement traffic rules or pay attention to keep away from passing vehicles, which offended The Regulation of the People¡¯s Republic of China on Road Traffic Administration the 58th item in Rule No. 7 and the 3rd item in Rule No.7, and that behavior was the main cause of the accident. Party Xu Shaoqi¡¯s drunk driving and speeding disobeyed The Regulation of the People¡¯s Republic of China on Road Traffic Administration the 6th item in Rule No.26 and The Regulation of Jilin Province on Road Traffic Administration the 7th item in Rule No.46, which was the subordinate cause of the accident. According to Rule No.19 in The People¡¯s Republic of China for Handling Road Traffic Accidents, it was confirmed that Xia Lianqun took the main responsibility to the accident and Xu Shaoqi took the subordinate responsibility to the accident. Transactor: Gao Jian, Liu Qiang (with name print) Liaoyuan Traffic Accident Handling Group of Pointsmen Detachment (with cachet) November 30th,1998 ========================================================================================= ¢ò The deceased who should not have taken responsibility to the accident was not only imposed the responsibility but also forced to pay 100 RMB as penalty: Road Traffic Accident Punishment Order No. 2110153 Time of Proclaimnation: November 30th, 1998 Party: Xia Lianqun Female, 41-year old on November 13th, 1998 She has a traffic accident thirty meters south to Yindu Bathhouse on Kuangdian Street, who should take the main responsibility. According to Rule No.20 of The People¡¯s Republic of China for Handling Road Traffic Accidents, she is punished for 100 RMB. Administrative reconsideration petition to the legal department of higher Public Security sub-bureau is permitted within fifteen days if there is any disagreement. Statutory delegate£ºXiao Tongshan (with name print) Liaoyuan Traffic Accident Handling Group of Pointsmen Detachment. (with cachet) This copy is for the punished party. £¨deceased£© ========================================================================================= ¢ó Procuratorate denied the fact on purpose and did not place a case that should be put on record by law: People¡¯s Procuratorate of Jilin Province Liaoyuan City Longshan District Notice of Not Placing a Case (2000) No. 1 of Liaolong Inspection law of Not Series Xia Yuanfeng sued related people in Liaoyuan Traffic Accident Handling Group of Pointsmen Detachment for Irregularities for Favoritism. According to the censor of procuratorate, no criminal evidence is collected and discovered. We inform you that the case is decided not to be placed according to Rule No. 86 of Criminal Procedure Law of the People¡¯s Republic of China. People¡¯s Procuratorate of Liaoyuan City Longshan District (with cachet) July 12th, 2000 ========================================================================================= ¢ô Contract with Funeral Home Contract No. 0000893 Time of arrival of body: April 6th, 1999 Sender: Xia Yuanfeng Add: No. 6 Team in 4 Group of Nankang Street, Longshan District. Tel: __ _ Responsibility of Sender: 1, Be charged for keeping body 2, Make compensation of the losses and damages of public properties in the funeral home. 3, The contract works in Liaoyuan. 4, The fee for keeping body should be settled a day before moving out the body. 5, Invoice is not reissued out of regulated period of time. 6 This contract is executed in triplicate. 7 Be Effective with signatures of both parties. Service department of Funeral Home management: Driver: Cui Jinghua Monitor: Guan Yunfeng Add: 83 Xiangyang Street Tel: 0437-3512999 Responsibility of Funeral Home: 1, Be responsible for keeping the body. 2, Pick up the body for free. 3, Friendly negotiation is preferred to solve problems if there is any dissension, if it does not work, both sides can lodge a complaint to People¡¯ Court¡£ ========================================================================================= The administrative executive department, which is responsible for handling the accident is not to Remove Criminal Cases to judicial organizations to solve the problem, and plots out responsibility on purpose irregularly. Additionally, they impose responsibility to the victim and force to collect penalty. In recent ten years, I rushed about to appeal to the higher authorities for help in Beijing. However, there is still no just solution. On March 21st, 2001, a special case group of four accredited by public security bureau at the levels of provinces came to Liaoyuan, the minister of accident department (two of the members belong to provincial Pointsmen Chief Group, who are original handlers of this case) gave us an unwritten response: Drunk driving is peccancy, but peccancy should not take main responsibility to this accident. Because ¡®drunk driving¡¯ has no direct relationship with the death of the victim: the team leader of specialist group, the minister of supervision department of public security bureau at the levels of provinces also said: ¡®Drunk driving¡¯ is a fact, but ¡®speeding¡¯ is not confirmed. The provincial and city procuratorate did not give Cases for Direct Acceptance to the executive department to handle cases collectively of Not to Remove Criminal Cases. A relative of the peacebreaker said in the office of accident ministry: We just bumped a person to death! It is not a big matter! The secretary of politics and law ministry advised us to withdraw the lawsuit, and said You have sued in the Ministry of Public Security for eight years, and there will be no change in another eight years! Your case is a small piece of cake in Liaoyuan! The minister of City Bureau for Letters and Calls said: Only the U.N. can solve the problem¡¡ (Ministry of Public Security)This case hung in the balance for a long time, they insist on the unfair Road Traffic Accident Responsibility Confirming Letter and refuse to cancel or change it according to the People's Police Law of the People's Republic of China. They refuse to execute the law fairly¡¡ What else can I expect? (Ministry of Public Security)Although I do not deny that the peacebreaker should take on total responsibility of this accident, the written reply of Road Traffic Accident Reliability Reconfirming Letter of making the peacebreaker take on total responsibility is still not worked out. It causes that the artificial irregular grievance has not had a just parlance, so that the body of the inculpable victim is still kept in the funeral home, and can not get cremation. Meanwhile, I appeal to the international just people who maintain people¡¯s rights and can help me to get justice. Let¡¯s build a harmonious society! Liaoyuan City, Jilin Province(China) Brother of Victim: Xia Yuanfeng ========================================================================================= Primitive evidence <a href="http://upload8.postimage.org/747461/ConfirmingLetterofReliabilityofRoadTrafficAccide.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://upload8.postimage.org/747461/ConfirmingLetterofReliabilityofRoadTrafficAccide.jpg</a> <a href="http://upload8.postimage.org/747504/RoadTrafficAccidentPunishmentOrder.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://upload8.postimage.org/747504/RoadTrafficAccidentPunishmentOrder.jpg</a> <a href="http://upload8.postimage.org/747613/NoticeofNotPlacingaCase.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://upload8.postimage.org/747613/NoticeofNotPlacingaCase.jpg</a> <a href="http://upload8.postimage.org/747914/ContractwithFuneralHome.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://upload8.postimage.org/747914/ContractwithFuneralHome.jpg</a> starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7351 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:43:55 +0000 starlight 7351@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ is not believing in anything...yet another belief? and in living a happy, honest and moral life...is that not believing in happiness...honesty...and a moral life? cortex on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7349 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:36:01 +0000 cortex 7349@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ ekanta, morality has nothing to do with religion, while religion has everything to do with morality. in essence, you dont need to believe in anything in order to live a happy, honest and moral life. Ekanta on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7347 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:16:23 +0000 Ekanta 7347@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ cortex: How do you differ between "do only whats right" and fairytales? cortex on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7344 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 17:01:10 +0000 cortex 7344@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ who cares, live your life honestly and do only whats right, the rest is useless wishful thinking and a bunch of fairytales starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7342 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 16:40:23 +0000 starlight 7342@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Ekanta! so good to see you! great post! all there is is GRACE... :) Ekanta on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7340 Sat, 09 Jun 2007 16:27:08 +0000 Ekanta 7340@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Hi, long time no seen. I was looking at the site and happened to interest me in this thread. Anyway how I see it: BELIEVERS = Connection with the source, i.e. true spirituality JEWS AND GENTILES = Signifies religion doesnâ€™t matter ENGRAFTED = having found the path/grace and holding on to it/enforcing it OLIVE TREE = Origin is God/grace. Jesus originated from God. However His message, his grace, his teachings is the olive tree. What makes us again connect to truth/God. Olive tree can also be seen as God himself. UNBELIEVERS = NO Connection with the source, i.e. true spirituality. So: All "true spiritual people", "whatever religion", are "by grace attached to/have found" GOD's "spiritual path" or â€œGodâ€. "Non true spiritual people", "whatever religion", have not "by grace attached to/ found" GOD's "spiritual path" or â€œGodâ€. The whole message screams that the source, the "olive tree" is God/ God's grace. However with time every religion loses this connection more and more and degrades to formalia and rituals. So the olive tree can be said to be church since they carry the message of Jesus. It can also be said to be Israel since the Jews had part of the Lords grace too. But how much of the olive tree is left in either? Actually the olive tree in essence is neither church or Israel. God is not limited to name and form. OLIVE TREE simply means God and ENGRAFTED means grace. YaMaH on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7035 Sun, 27 May 2007 17:55:58 +0000 YaMaH 7035@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ this verse seems to be taken from the concept of 'Kares' or 'cutting off' which is deemed a punishment for various acts which make a person cut off from reward in the world to come. According to this, the soul root of the righteous exists in the future and the 'perfect community' which will exist in the future times would be the 'olive tree'. This 'perfect community' will have as its core the chosen ones of HaShem, which I hold to remain the Jewish people, and will also include all the righteous of the nations. Your verse seems to support the view that the Jewish people remain with a special status - in that they were specifically mentioned. If it did not hold that the Jews have a special status it would not have mentioned them by name. starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7009 Sun, 27 May 2007 05:18:31 +0000 starlight 7009@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ BOM...God and you are mixed up in the same body...or is the body you...and God is the life in the body...or is God the spirit...in the body...who are you? just a body...how can you be just a body? a body is nothing...but some water...and other stuff...dust... God is consciousness...the source of all...mind...where did this body come from? man is an image of consciousness...creative energy... i know that you have much knowledge in the scriptures (and otherwise)...so could you instead of explaining what is, through the tree and the branch and the root...explain it through physics for me...please... how were we created...and from what were we created...and why...? AsI on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7003 Sun, 27 May 2007 02:20:18 +0000 AsI 7003@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ It matters not to me. One cannot harm God nor can one harm illusion. I now leave the forum with blessings to all and with warm thanks of love. He who was known as AsIDream AsI on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-7002 Sun, 27 May 2007 00:13:13 +0000 AsI 7002@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ So, the brideofIsrael whose fervent loving heart of God would be condemned to an eternal hell by a loving God whereas the fervent loving heart of thebodyofthemessiah will not be? And you would ask others if love is the church or Israel? And you do not see "God equally loves each and every child of Itself" but you would preach as though you do otherwise and use God vainly to justify your words by scripture you yourself do not fully understand. "Them I get past the "veil". You do not see past the veil of your own making, and you See Not. AsI on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/328#post-6992 Sat, 26 May 2007 17:05:53 +0000 AsI 6992@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ "I will ask everyone: [b]Is HIS OLIVE TREE the church or ISRAEL?[/b]" There is no believing in Knowing. What you say is scripture and you will respond with scripture for this is your believing, and you can say no more than this for you do not Know. What is it that you do not Know? You do not know what (rather than who) you are. When this happens, you will not longer be a Chistian nor a Muslim nor a Hindu. In fact, there will be no "you" at all. No longer will there be a God of vengeance nor an eternal hell. No longer will you change from a brideofisrael to thebodyofthemessiah. Unlike you, I am not here to save nor condemn. Yes, you will say that God does this and not you. So, the answer to your question: God is all, but more importantly, you are God; yet, "you" do not exist except in the imaginings of your ego. You think that you have already died to be reborn. This death is of your ego and of your God itself. Then you will find nothing and everything. The real difference between what you say and what I say is that I do not care what you say nor worry of your salvation whereas you do. I see you as Love, but you will not be able to say the same for me. You will respond with scripture that you do not even understand yet. Everything Jesus said is true, but he did not die for our sins since sin does not exist. The only "sin" there can be is that of the idea of being separate from God. Is "his" olive tree the church or Israel? In the sense that you are asking-No. Of course, you must cast aside what I say for it threatens everything that you believe. Religion is not Knowing and that is why there are so many religions. Mankind will fight over beliefs, but not of Knowing. I will not argue with you either, but I have given you my answer to your question which you made not for yourself but for others. Indeed though, the only one listening is yourself as you can see by the many responses you have gotten. "Who" is asking the question? When you can truly answer that, you will have the true answer. starion on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6894 Fri, 25 May 2007 13:58:31 +0000 starion 6894@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Here on earth we make divisions. You are this; I am that. You say this; I say that. God says to each of us. "This is my beloved in whom I am well pleased!" God cares not the religion, belief or disbelief, the color, shape, gender or intelligence. God equally loves each and every child of Itself. Every inch/noninch bit of universe. meekness on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6892 Fri, 25 May 2007 13:07:25 +0000 meekness 6892@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ Good morning, all, as it is morning here. I haven't thought too deeply about this subject. I am aware that Christ is the Root and the Branch of David. So, in this allegorical tree talked of in Romans, perhaps this tree pertains to the life we find in the promises, given to David, fulfilled in Christ. Another side of this allegory is this: this tree represents the cycle of living and death. This tree pertains to and alludes to the fact that everything does share the same breath, (and some would refer to this as inter-being). The focus in this passage is actually about two things, however. 1) God can do whatever He wants, for all is in His power, and 2) We need to bear fruit worthy of remaining grafted to this tree, and in the Christian lifestyle this should be love, joy, peace, etc. Let us not forget that to bear fruit is actually so that others may benefit and partake of this fruit, not to keep this fruit to ourselves. just my meager thoughts -meekness thebodyofmessiah on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6888 Fri, 25 May 2007 07:59:21 +0000 thebodyofmessiah 6888@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ I don't just want to be close to GOD. HE WANTS to LIVE through me, HIS BRANCH, with HIM as the ROOT to the OLIVE TREE, ISRAEL. I wamt the same thing. Them I get past the "veil", LIVE in the holy of holys, WORSHIP at the brazen alter in me, LIVE in a state of faith and peace and joy...... LOVE, RICOEL lol on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6886 Fri, 25 May 2007 06:51:00 +0000 lol 6886@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ According to Romans 11 all BELIEVERS, Jews and Gentiles, are ENGRAFTED onto GOD YHSHWH'S OLIVE TREE. unbelievers, Jews and Gentiles, are broken off or not ENGRAFTED onto HIS OLIVE TREE. I will ask everyone: Is HIS OLIVE TREE the church or ISRAEL? LOVE, RICOEL its neither , it in just being close to God being past the "veil" its being in the holy of holys :) past the brazen alter, in a state of faith and peace and joy...... starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6883 Fri, 25 May 2007 06:01:21 +0000 starlight 6883@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ even if it does not believe that it is a toe...is it not still a toe? Peyotero on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6882 Fri, 25 May 2007 06:01:14 +0000 Peyotero 6882@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ The bride of whom? Frankenstein? starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6881 Fri, 25 May 2007 05:57:10 +0000 starlight 6881@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ ROTF... :) exactly...ONE... if a toe calls itself a jew or a christian...is it still not a toe? thebodyofmessiah on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6878 Fri, 25 May 2007 05:25:01 +0000 thebodyofmessiah 6878@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ STARLIGHT, there is ONLY ONE BODY. ONE BRIDE. Anam, go ahead without me. LOVE, RICOEL Anam on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6866 Fri, 25 May 2007 01:25:06 +0000 Anam 6866@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ thebodyofmessiah Which messiah? Gods interest in us humans is limited to a very small number of pure or righteous souls. I got my table in hell ready and expect most of my good friends to join me there theologically speaking that is...and Iâ€™m bringing marsh mallows.Like me to hold you a seat? Live long Stay Blessed Anam starlight on "According to Romans 11" http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/topic/329#post-6863 Fri, 25 May 2007 01:17:00 +0000 starlight 6863@http://collectionofthoughts.com/bbpress/ holding on to the identity of either, is seperation.